The shields are more prevalent on the bay than the ships themselves!

Vague thread name... Edited thread name. Thread was originally just about the big shield.

I wanna talk about some little changes we can make to this item. Not so much buffing or nerfing it, just minor adjustments. It's the only 2pt blue item, but it's also usually the most optimal choice there is. What can be done about this?

My idea is to raise all ships speed and speed cap by 10% and make big shields reduce your speed and speed cap by 10%. Doing this would not change the speed of any ship that currently uses a big shield, but instead would make ships without big shields 10% faster. It doesn't have to be 10%, but it should make a clear difference.

I got this idea when I heard once from someone that they were told a big shield makes you slower. While this isn't true, I thought it would make sense to believe it. A "colossal" slab of armor should have some weight to it after all.

I'd like for something like this to inspire some creative builds instead of everyone using a big shield due to it being the most optimal choice. The extra speed from unequipping a big shield could convince some players to switch to a standard shield for more speed, or possibly even try one of the less popular items like the rudder and gear lube.

The only issue with this idea is that of someone using multiple big shields. The speed reduction would then outweigh the base speed boost. My only solution to this is to make the speed reduction not stack with multiple big shields. Edit: Cutting this bit out, nobody uses more than 1 big shield.

Additionally, the fixer should not experience any speed change, as they were never able to effectively equip a big shield either way.

I realized another problem when @Crashedup mentioned the enforcers. No ships are able to use a big shield at Mk1. Well, some are, but it's not the most efficient use of the slots. This isn't much of a problem, we can simply adjust the lower Mks' speed boost by something smaller than 10%, so you still experience a slight speed boost at lower levels, but still lose speed when opting to use a big shield. This may also encourage earlier players to more efficiently utilize their ships' slots. Let me also add that I think it'd be of current players' best interests for the speed reduction to never exceed their current minimum. For example, if a Mk1 only gets a 3% speed buff, the big shield will only reduce speed by 3%.

The bigger issue from Crashedup's mention was the more specific situation this would put the enforcers in. While they can technically use a big shield from the moment they get 2 blue slots, it's a highly unpopular choice. Most enforcers would only see this as an incredible buff to the enforcer's speed from Mk5 and below, regardless of how we scale it. No other ship gains the ability to use a big shield so late into the game, so even the smaller speed buffs would feel like unnecessary buffs. Conversely, we can't simply remove the buff for Mk5 and below as this would result in a sudden spike in speed for players upgrading from Mk5 to Mk6 and opting out of using a big shield. Yes, the whole point is to buff non-big shield users to make it a viable choice, but this would be too sudden of a change from one Mk to another.

My solution? Introduce this feature to the standard shield as well, but to a lesser effect. If the big shield reduces speed by 10%, the standard shield can reduce speed by just 3%. We can step back to how the enforcer's speed should scale with this change, and it will be a little easier to manage their speed buffs since many enforcers use a standard shield. With this, I think it's ok for the speed reductions to stack. It means more health = less speed. Defenders, however, should not experience any loss of speed when equipping shields, after all, they're massive tanks designed to carry a ton of weight. #indirect defender buff

Now the only issue I see is that if players are even tempted to ditch their shields, they have to worry about weapons that can obliterate them in 4 shots or less. If we make the speed reduction heavier but also buff everyone's base hp, players would be more willing to give up their shields for something else to make their ship lighter. I'll be honest, it's kind of ludicrous that most of the time more than half of your hp is comprised of shields. Shooters should be able to keep their big and standard shields if they use them already, and they'll face a hefty hp buff with a speed nerf as well.

Can I get some feedback on this idea? I think it would liven up the bay with more diverse playstyles. Let's say it together, "The shields are more prevalent on the bay than the ships themselves."

 

Your idea has potential. It adds depth to the game. Currently, blue items are straight to the point just bonus stats. With this, it might open up some unorthodox build.

 

No ships equip multiple big shield as slot don't allow for it except for defender who also doesn't do that generally as it's reduces ship health significantly due to loss of 4 epic health perks.
Secondly big shield is too important to be left out as it's makes up the majority of the health of the ships and no one would lose a big chunk( around 3k+ for max epic I think) of health for just few pts of increase of speed considering thier are highly powered weapons in the bay.
If you had introduced this idea against bandage a quite of few people might consider it especially shooters and defenders.
As of now ur idea is simply to increase the speed of fixer or maybe enfocer as few of them could switch to bandage instead of big shield

 

Hmm I like the idea, it sounds good

 

The idea is mostly to give a boost to people who don't want to use a big shield but have to use one anyway because it's the best option. Giving up 3000 or so health should give the player some kind of boost to compensate. I used to use a rudder on my mk5 speeder instead of a big shield, but the big shield simply yields better results. It feels limiting being almost forced to use this item. If I moved faster without it, I'd probably stick to using a rudder. The extra speed could definitely save some health on its own, so you're not really giving up a full 3000 or so.

As for your argument about this being a straight up buff for the fixer and pre-mk6 enforcer, I agree that it would have that flaw. It could be fixed by leaving out giving the fixer a speed buff, since they won't be losing any potential speed to begin with. The same could be said for enforcers pre mk6 and other ship tiers that are unable to equip a single big shield optimally.

 

Ur idea is good for lower infamy as infamy tanker or Noobs put on two big shield without rudder and run around killing lower mk ship due to sheer power that have over them and using ur idea would have lower mk's to evade them but at higher infamy players are good and everyone uses a good turbo so they already have a decent speed and important thing is they are accurate with Thier shots so low health would lead to ships getting killed way faster a 10% boost doesn't compensate for massive health reduction so it's not viable at higher infamy but if ur idea is implemented against bandage people would surely run different setup to get that speed boost because as of right now bandage is the best alternative in single slot item in the game and it's easily empowers over epic std shield and rudder and lube.
Ur idea if put against bandage provides a good alt for ships and will provide a different array of setups.
Ur idea is good imho it need some tweaks in order to make it viable.

 

Adding to my previous comment:

Another solution would be to make the standard shield also give a speed reduction, but only by 5% and the total reduction caps at 10%. This means that players packing multiple shields of any kind still retain their normal speed,

I like that you're helping me improve this idea instead of just chucking the idea aside. I can't agree with the bandage idea, though, for one reason and one reason only: the point of this thread is to get people to use other items instead of always choosing the big shield. I'd like to think of more ways we can benefit the player who wishes to use another item, but in a way that neither nerfs the big shield nor too heavily buffs non-big shield users. I have another thread open where I'm talking about adding new 2pt blue items to create some variety, but this thread is specifically about making changes to the big shield. I understand how important hp is, especially in the late-game, but it pains me to see this item killing variety and creativity in the blue items department. Anyone will agree that the big shield is an essential part of any setup that can utilize it, but that doesn't change my view. We can talk about doing something like this to the bandage in the bandage thread.

 

Remember, this change would allow any big shieldless ship to break the current speed cap, so it does help in the late-game as well. I'm also editing the original post to remove fixers' speed buff from this change as they were never able to efficiently use a big shield to begin with. Also more specific adjustments to the enforcer's speed. And apparently more buildup from what this discussion has told me thus far. I assume you read it lol.

 

Defenders would love this. They get an hp buff and get to stand tall as the only guys on the bay with such a tremendous presence on the battlefield. This should more than make up for their size and general lack of mobility. No need for fancy buffs for them. Just hp. The thing they were designed to have a ton of.

 

Now that I'm level 30 I'm anticipating this choice when I upgrade to M5. I love my bandages. The big shield (right now) is about 1100hp. The bandages are 5.8 per second. So I would need to be damaged for about 3 minutes for that to even out. I don't think that works out on the whole despite the fact that the bandages are E20 and the big shield is R23.

 

I gave up on shields but if my ship gets more speed, I love the idea, but wouldnt it also make sense to do the sam efor standard shields, as they technically have weight too. But then some might feel the speed differnec is too big and as no other items do s speed reduction that its unfair

 

They're also the only item to add hp, though. I think their base stats should include shield defense, too, to compensate. Whatever makes it still feel fair.