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Casual mode damaging the game

Discussion in 'Suggestions & Ideas' started by tr00po, 5 Apr 2019.

  1. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe MVP

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    Don't attack players please.

    Other than that, almost all of your points are valid. My breakdown of your points:
    • When you get to infamies you should not normally be able to(like when your gear is significantly weaker than others at that infamy), you are able to contribute in MUCH less tangible ways. Your system will punish the player for that.
    • As an extension to point 1, people will tank infamy to stay in a range where they are not penalized for losing with less damage. This will promote an indirect form of sealclubbing.
    • As a response to the example Su-57 gave about disconnectors... Life happens, basically. There's an equal chance of having a disconnector on both teams.
    • One of the points I disagree with is the uneven fixer distribution. If the game stacks up four fixers vs none, we have a problem. If it stacks up two versus zero, we don't. I'd like to see the system allow only a max difference of two when it comes to fixers.
    • I think you misunderstood his point? He was trying to say that increasing rewards in a gamemode may not help bring people back if the gamemode has severe balance issues and/or matchmaking issues. He gave an example in the form of the April Fools' event with the reduced perk prices and the instakill mortars.
     
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  2. TVNPryde

    TVNPryde Well-Known Member

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    I was not attacking him. I just feel he is try to make this game into his version without caring what’s right and wrong. A game can only be so good and you have to take the bad with it. He was describing exactly what is wrong with the system he is supporting.
     
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  3. Su-57

    Su-57 Well-Known Member

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    you are talking about my load out , i think i have done a good job building 8800 gearscore setup for my shooter . i started with uncommon items tested everything and then built what best for my style of play and for strategic battles according to situations close , long range and behind the obstacles and waves , i can use my setup in changing conditions , thats how it works then some events favor spamming of one or two items which you don't use . i mean one spent long time building a setup managing shortage of power cells and all that and then some event nerf mainly the items you use and then expecting not to hear any complaints lol .

    in one hand you all guys talk about strategic gaming then favoring spamming events ?

    and Antisnipe understood my point as i use recent april fool event as a example to explain , you can't attract players based on increase rewards as long as gaming experience is not improved .


    and i know Infamy based on individual have some flaws but Infamy based on team have more flaws . as i am getting targeted here by some players . just have another thought if some of the player in team make you loose battle on purpose , i mean this is also possible in team based infamy . team based infamy also have flaws . and forum is mainly about issues , bugs , and suggestions . i have also wrote about suggestions but seems like you only read about complaints . other people also complaints about issues with new updates but they decided not to be on forums . as i am now getting targeted i understand why they decided not to be on forums or discord .
     
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  4. Ash KOT

    Ash KOT MVP

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    Why do I avoid ranked?

    I pushed all the way to 3980 infamy, and would happily play ranked.

    The game then gave me a series of lopsided games and I dropped from 3980 down to 3700.

    I took a break as it was NML reset, and went back after a week, same problem and I dropped to 3500 after another busy night.

    Waited another few days, tried again and went down to 3300.

    In these games, I was constantly top for my team, I was using the same boat as I used to get to 3980 but with stronger gear and stronger talents?!

    So I have stuck to casual since, as when the teams are lopsided, it doesnt matter.

    I can still contribute to guild quests, I can still earn stars, and when the odds are against me, it doesnt matter.

    When matchmaking is fixed in ranked, and we have an even balance of fixers on each team, and are against similar infamy players then I will happily play ranked again.

    On the flip side has casual mode sucked so many players out of ranked it is causing the imbalance? Probably.
     
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  5. Mimmel

    Mimmel Member

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    I have dropped my infamy from 3700 to 2800. But it is a long time ago, before the casual mode exists. So it's not a new problem. At that time, as there was no casual, I just played and managed to overcome it. So, I am glad that I had no place to escape at that time.

    I also enjoy casual as I can enjoy my mini enforcer. But when I play with my main ship, fixer, I often get more frustrated in casual as casual mode matches are so unbalanced. Then, play ranked. It's much more exciting after casual and won:)

    I personally prefer less events. The current frequency is too much. It would be nice 3days long once a week as before.
     
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  6. benguin8

    benguin8 Well-Known Member

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    Yes Matchmaking is a core issue, but also one to not be solved overnight since it is quite complicated. To get me back into rank, I need several of the following:

    1. A double algorithm to easily fix the unbalanced fixer. Match-make and then check the # of fixers on each side. Make sure the change is not >1. I would probably consider a reaper as a fixer for this purpose.
    2. Guild quests x2 for ranked. Greater risk = greater reward. Yes I know there are season rewards which are decent, but you can stay out of ranked all season and still get those!
    3. If any ship does 0 damage the match is a draw. Nobody loses infamy. This will solve floaters and disconnects etc. Everyone who does damage will get +half infamy for wasting their time.
    4. Just like we get 3 free boxes a day, we should have the first 3-4 ranked matches only award infamy, not take it away. Consider it a warm up. This will populate ranked more as the risk starts out small before going full out.
    5. Set a bottom cap for how much infamy you can drop from your all time maximum. EVER. I would say 500 is more than enough.
     
    Last edited: 9 Apr 2019
  7. Su-57

    Su-57 Well-Known Member

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    i like the 3rd point , its interesting and not harmful at all .

    but 4th point have one problem , then maybe players will play only 3-4 battles every day to get infamy rewards for first few battles .
     
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  8. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe MVP

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    Could be exploited imho
     
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  9. Su-57

    Su-57 Well-Known Member

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    everything have some backdrops haha

    let say 0 reward if there is a disconnected player in battle no matter in friendly team or unfriendly .
     
  10. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe MVP

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    No, it can be heavily exploited. I could have a fleetmate afk at spawn who I'd tell to not do any damage till the outcome of the match was almost set.
     
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  11. Su-57

    Su-57 Well-Known Member

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    0 infamy gain or lose would be good .
     
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  12. benguin8

    benguin8 Well-Known Member

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    Noted and agreed. Everyone would have to get 0 infamy. Remember that a draw does not count for guild quests so that is balanced
     
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  13. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe MVP

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    But then some people could really boost ladder wins! -0 for what is basically a loss, and +24 for a win...
     
  14. benguin8

    benguin8 Well-Known Member

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  15. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe MVP

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    Okay hold on. But what if I do this?

    My fleetmate is chilling and not doing any damage, until I see that the match is:
    • Turning in our favor: The teammate comes online and does a token amount of damage, we win, +24 infamy, woohoo~!
    • Going badly: We die, the teammate stays AFK, 0 infamy lost or gained, so we can continue on our infamy grind with this battle basically not having happened at all.
    This is what I fear from this mechanic.
     
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  16. Su-57

    Su-57 Well-Known Member

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    is there any way system knows if player is disconnected or just acting ?

    there should be some way because sometimes its show low server icon in orange or even red . orange is when game keep working but dmg doesn't count sometimes other players seems like not moving at all . when icon shows red game just completely stop and restart . maybe system can decide based on that if someone is acting or there is some server issues .
     
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  17. benguin8

    benguin8 Well-Known Member

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    Manipulatable for sure, but to what degree of success? If a match starts as 5v4 that is very hard to overcome and win. Its generally lost from the start. I have won a handful of 4v5 though, so not impossible.

    Here is another case I have no thought for and it happened to be several times recently. The game wants to disconnect while I am joining a match. So when I relaunch the app and get into the match mid-way, it is usually too late, but I do some damage just to get a few coins etc. The game HAS to have some way to know someone was disconnected or no movement for 60 seconds etc.
     
  18. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    Correct, it's always been +60% bonus, not +160% for NML.

    As I've mentioned, the issue with ranked is the 3000 Infamy delta amongst ranked match participants. I'm sure you enjoy seal clubbing lower league players, but no one likes to be seal clubbed. If ranked was much less RNG than casual, I'd play ranked instead. Less RNG in ranked means playing with others around your Infamy, +/-10%. Anything short of that is not a ranked match. That's the problem to fix to get players back into Ranked... nothing else will do.
     
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  19. Nicolas

    Nicolas Well-Known Member

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    Firstly, I don't sealclub, so I clearly won't enjoy sealclubbing.
    Secondly, when there is a big gap between team A and team B then - let's assume it's a total of 23.5k infamy vs 21.5k infamy - then you will automatically gain less/lose more. I gain average of +19 and lose average of -27 per match. tbh, it's too easy to win.
    Why is there a large gap in infamy? For the simple fact that players left for the non-competitive mode where they enjoy sealclubbing :) with good rewards and no risks.

    If they reduce the difference we will end up with 5 fixer teams too often then you will ask for ship type matchmaking and more nerfs to the matchmaker. If we ignore the reasons why ppl are in casual not ranked and if we ignore the reasons why some ships/items are overused then no matter how much you change in matchmaker, the problems won't be solved. In inverse, you will be just pushing players away from the game.

    Edit: To not forget, sealclubbers need to be matched with players who they are supposed to be with not newbies. When you see a very low infamy player on your team (ignoring the fact that there should be another one on unfriends side), he will be most probably a sealclubber.
     
    Last edited: 9 Apr 2019
  20. Nicolas

    Nicolas Well-Known Member

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    There are too many posts since last time I checked this thread. Is it worth reading?
     
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