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Balancing Fire weapons

Discussion in 'Game Discussion' started by Reorge, 31 Oct 2018.

  1. SeaNavy

    SeaNavy Well-Known Member

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    Lol, for me it's the other way around, and I've been a flare user for over half a month and I am yet to master it.

    I meant year, not month lol
     
  2. Mad_Bulls_007

    Mad_Bulls_007 Well-Known Member

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    3ohc1e3hEhS1vFHb9e.gif
     
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  3. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    Back in the day (a couple months ago) FB would usually tick for full duration, that's absolutely been fixed. On average I'm only getting half duration from FB as with the new agility, all boats can escape to at least the outer rings, if not the entire target area before it lands.

    In fact I just watched several replays from tonight looking for this issue. I'm seeing players just outside the ring being completely untouched. Players on the edge of the ring tick for just a few seconds. Players hit a little closer to the center tick for 10 seconds, and only full duration in a dead center shot. I'm just not seeing the issues you guys are pointing out.

    Also I just zoomed in on the animated GIF above... all those durations were single digits, and most were inside-ring shots, not rim.
     
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  4. Fixer sa Recto

    Fixer sa Recto Well-Known Member

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    yeah right
     
  5. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe Moon's haunted

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    I think the entire issue is that the FB has the flight time of a semi-Berta and the radius of a semi-ballpark. This leads to the actual painted radius being rather different from what is about to hit, which causes problems. Now, on maps with less waves, this effect is less noticeable, while in maps with more waves, it is much more noticeable.

    I think the right approach, for firebomb at least, would be a general rework of radius to show actual painted circles. Because, by my guesswork, the projectile is generated predictably, the waves are generated predictably. Sure it'll be hard, but it should be possible to accurately predict the future path of a mortar projectile perfectly.

    As I've said before in many "Balance Firebomb" threads, before trying to nerf it, we need to see if the weapon is working as intended. Inconsistency is, I think, the scariest factor of the FB because of which so many are asking for a nerf.

    If they simply implement a real-time radius painting mechanism, I really think we'll be seeing a lot less "Nerf FB" threads.
     
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  6. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    Yes, and it's important to reiterate the target drawing issue is the same on all aerial weapons, not just FB. I remember examining a replay over an over when I lost the final 1v1 when I could have sworn I hit the player with missiles multiple times, prior to the agility changes. I watched the replay from several angles, saw the targets on the player but there was no damage taken. Waves were big, so it was obviously the drawing problem as frustrating as it was, I had to accept it.

    It is a difficult problem to keep the target accurate with the wave activity, a solvable problem for sure, but not easy. Until then players just have to accept that it is registering accurate hits. If in doubt watch replays in Midnight Madness where there are no waves, and thus no target drawing issues.
     
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  7. Sreg

    Sreg Active Member

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    I had such an idea, but what if the fire bomb changed the red fire to the blue fire, and the blue fire would not increase the damage for the cannons?
     
  8. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    Then no one would use it. It's a largely under-powered weapon if not for the fire bonus.
     
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  9. Sreg

    Sreg Active Member

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    Everything will be fine. FB itself well causes damage.
     
  10. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    Sure, T5E FB hits for 2052 as compared to 2714 for Big Berta... seems even :rolleyes: Do you want to turn your Grenade's Fire damage to blue as well? With Fire crit it hits harder than a FB.
     
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  11. nosesabe

    nosesabe Well-Known Member

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    In my opinion flare is balanced. Firebomb on the other hand... don’t get me start it with it cos it’s just ridiculous that Rovio hasn’t balanced it yet. Reduce damage or make it more difficult to use.
     
  12. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe Moon's haunted

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    LMAO:D You're right LOLOL
     
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  13. Agile Vanguard

    Agile Vanguard Well-Known Member

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    We already got a flare nerf remember?

    Teal items.
     
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  14. Reorge

    Reorge Well-Known Member

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    I don't like the idea. People use fire weapons (Firebomb) for many reasons. It improves battle rewards, heavily increases cannon dmg, deals massive dmg and has long range. In your suggestion firebomb will lose 2 of it's major abilities. It won't solve the problem of firebomb spam but would make the people carrying single Firebomb to not use it.

    What Firebomb needs now is a proper balance in it's radius. I often burn for 15 secs even when I'm just in the edge of the ring. If they fix it I'm pretty sure that there would be a lot less people spamming firebombs cuz then it would actually require some effort to use
     
    Last edited: 14 Dec 2018
  15. Reorge

    Reorge Well-Known Member

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    Cleanse pulse can be considered a serious nerf to Firebomb spams but you only mentioned flare in your post, which makes me think you're defending your favourite weapon.
    So fire should have only one counter ? Ok I would like to suggest repair bolts to not remove stun/frost and hitting the stunned/frozen target shouldn't break the stun/freeze cuz there are "teal items" already which can almost remove the stun/freeze completely :rolleyes:
     
  16. Sreg

    Sreg Active Member

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    And how do you think that blue fire cannot be cleaned?
    And what about the grenade? her fire burns only 5 seconds, and the firing range and the radius of destruction leaves much to be desired. Or would you like to make a bomb like a big grenade that looks like an explosive cannon compared to a blast?
     
  17. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe Moon's haunted

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    Good attempt at sarcasm my dude, but you need to make it shorter and much, MUCH more subtle.
    As for this. Fire does have multiple counters. One, it only "tags" enemies without having any "physical" debuffs, ignited people only have to get out of cannon range when hit. Two, a fire weapon reduces your net burst potential, unlike stun and frost, which are yellows and don't affect burst potential. There's quite a few of these indirect factors that counter fire, though none are really coded into the game's mechanics.

    Although fire needs some nerf, I don't see where your position is on this matter. Care to clarify?
     
  18. Reorge

    Reorge Well-Known Member

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    Lol pretty sure I made it intentionally obvious but thanks
     
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  19. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    I was just trying to illustrate that weapons each have their own balancing, and Grenade is yet another example that hits harder than FB, yet is a 1-slot point item.
     
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