Defender is poor

@*JAWS* IF gear lube and rudder significance can be improved over HP,it will really help defender(since they have loads of blue slot)

I have an idea for lube:

+5% increase in point shoot damage Halfway in burnice tree ON APPLICATION OF LUBE
+5% endgame increase endgame (last level of burnice)

 

I have no quarrels with my mk5 defender. It just takes time to get the hp up through talents. And yes it’s a tank but you can’t just charge anywhere you want by yourself. it sucks when it has two weapons. After that defender is a solid ship.

 

At my infamy (1500) Shooter and Fixer seem to be the only balanced boats. I can beat both Defender and Speeder 1-on-1 90% of the time because I simply outgun them. The problem with Defender is the time it takes to take them out, I will not only get significant damage from a Defender, but if a second or third enemy targets me I have to run or I'm toast. Turret upgrade is actually a really good idea for the Defender... would take a nice slice out of any speeder who tries to attack, and a slice out of any Speeder trying to get away.

 

Dude leave my shooter alone.
Shooter is the weakest class when it comes to defense. Yellow boats have nitroes to outrun fire barrage or use shield to protect themselves. Defenders have tons of hp and high defense to tank all the fire. We shooters have nothing of the sort, we're too slow to outrun the fire and not enough hp to tank it.

Guns are the only thing we have, with it we can put some fight and hope to take the opponents out before they destroy us.

 

Probably because shooter aka warrior class are JACKS OF ALL TRADES

 

And where do you think all the barrage fire is coming from? It’s not speeders that are lighting you up with overlapping mortars every two seconds.

 

I'm fine with mortar barrage. After playing shooter for a while you'll start to learn to not play so reckless and get yourself in that situation.
Also as a shooter ( I suppose some other classes too) you must absolutely not go anywhere alone, stick with teammates so you always have someone to back you up.
Playing with those basics in mind, you'll be fine most of the time.

Mortar barrage only happen because a ship get caught alone, when that happen, all the enemies attention are focused on you. By going with teammates you can avoid that because their attentions are split to all of your team.

 

Well then what’s the problem? If you’re fine with it, and you know how to avoid it, why do you need so much hp and defense?

Shooters at my level typically have about 4k hp and ~20 defense. My best gun does about 500 damage. That means it would take me 9 shots with my best weapon to solo one. With the cooldown that’s 108 seconds (almost 2 mins). With my second gun I could maybe bring that down to 1 minute (of continuous fire). A shooter can literally kill me in 6 to 8 seconds.

Yes, if someone knows how to play speeder, and doesn’t make any mistakes, they might be able to stun and Nitro around long enough to get the ~10 shots required, but that doesn’t in any way make it balanced.

 

Shooters don't have "so much hp and defense", we have barely enough. As I said before shooters don't have yellow items to shield or run we're gonna need some extra hp's to get out of sticky situations.

Also, if shooter can kill you in 6-8 second, you're doing something wrong. You have yellow items, you can equip nitro which make you nearly impossible to hit, or shield that turn you invincible, or tesla bolt that render other ships useless.
You have all the options in the world, you might just not using it properly.

 

Some of your options can turn against you buddy.

Since last update, stunning endurance now continues after a hit, witch is fair, so less time you’ll have to wait do shoot again at each Tesla shot.

Shield can give you a stun if hit with an RG or Critical Hit. Now you’re the one that can’t do something for a while.

Shooters don’t have much HP, but they have a good number of red and blue slots. You can compensate shooter’s lack of HP, speed and agility with some items and perks. And can turn out to be a very hard opponent vs a speeder.

And yes, a shooter can kill you in 6 - 8 seconds. Check Christmas or BeatleX rigs, insane.

 

Keep the discussion focused on why defender is not poor
@ViscountSniffit maybe you start a new thread to tell your views but rest assured there we will incredible amount of salt coming your way.

 

The operative words is ‘can’, it has nothing to do with me, or the way I play. It’s a mathematical fact, that a ship with 4-5 guns ‘can’ (easily) output 1800 damage in 8 seconds (that’s only 450 per gun). While a speeder, shooting the other way, can spend minutes landing shot after shot, and barely make a dent in all the hp shooters have. It has nothing to do with lack of ‘skill’, it’s just a mathematical impossibility.

 

Can we buff the defender already? I want to be in Nightmare league asap

 

I think enforcer is more poorer than defender...

 

Well, if the operative word is CAN, then speeders also CAN go circle around shooter and perma-stun it to oblivion.
What's the difference?

 

In that situation the operative word is MUST, or else the speeder will die quickly to the shooter’s huge mathematical advantage.

And they are so different, I hardly know where to begin.

Firstly, it’s not easy to do: you need to keep up the manoeuvre long enough to land 8-9 shots (which, as I’ve explained, can take over a minute), one mistake and you’re toast. When you break the stun, you need to be behind the turret, or you need to have a Testla Shield (which requires at least mk5). Otherwise, you’re taking a BC to the face, which is half your hit points. The Tesla Bolt has also been nerfed, so the duration halves each time, and the resistance stacks, so unless you can dance around for double the length of the stun, it will get shorter and shorter. Secondly, it doesn’t work if there is another unfriend near by, it’s extremely difficult to get behind the turret if the shooter is near a wall, and you need to do all this while also avoiding mines.

tl:dr

The difference is, one is a highly skilled strategy, that requires practice, a lot of crew training, levelling, and some luck.

The other is an advantage that’s built into the ship.

Just because the speeder can win, if he plays with great care and skill, that doesn’t mean it’s a fair fight.

 

Ya at this point I can't use a rudder because I need my hp due to how slow it is .
I do love my defender tho

 

The analogy for his argument (I think) is like stepping into the ring with Mike Tyson...
Sure, any of us could "fight perfectly", never get hit, and somehow do enough damage over a long enough period of time to somehow score a knockout...
But, if you slip up just once and let him land a hit, it's lights out...

That's the argument he's trying to make anyway...

I don't know whether I agree with the severity of it, but just thought it might help to clarify...

 

Lol, that’s kinda spooky you should say that

When I was typing, I was trying to think of a good analogy, and I was literally gonna use “like a fight with Mike Tyson”.

The only reason I didn’t was because I was worried that any millennials reading, might not know who Mike Tyson is xD

 

HAHAHA, I was worried about the same thing! I'm like "Man, I hope kids these days know who I'm talking about..."