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Nerf Shooter Thread!

Discussion in 'Game Discussion' started by DragonLegend, 25 Sep 2018.

  1. xArrogance

    xArrogance Well-Known Member

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    Yeah. I'm not holding my breath for it

    But, otherwise...

    I don't have any underleveled ships (other than a Mk5 fixer) so I can't say for sure .. but it looked like the players I always see gearing up their Mk3s for events weren't doing that this event.

    So either that particular loophole has been closed or there was no advantage for doing so this event.
     
  2. ShortFlyer

    ShortFlyer Active Member

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    Talking about "seal clubbing".
    Simple idea.
    Devs! Don't let Captain lvl 10 and Captain lvl 46 to fight in the same battle.

    As simple as that.
    Just create some virtual "groups" for battles. Maybe each 10 captain levels. Like "10-20", "21-30", etc... I don't know. But it's much more easy than trying to set some limits depending on ship & weapon tiers.
     
    RACK STAR and wtfack like this.
  3. xArrogance

    xArrogance Well-Known Member

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    As soon as someone hits level 21, 31, or 41 and sees a huge jump in competition .. then comes here complaining about it and threatening to quit, we'll know whom to thank for their simple idea.
     
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  4. ShortFlyer

    ShortFlyer Active Member

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    As I mentioned before, I don't know how to do it exactly.
    Maybe just something like... Not allow more than 20/25/30 difference between captain levels in one battle.
     
    RACK STAR likes this.
  5. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    Infamy is flawed if we are seeing Captain L10 vs Captain L20+ in the same matches... but patching up matchmaking by incorporating Captain Level is just covering the root of the problem with duct tape and pretending a real fix is in place. We're already seeing that in EventMatchmaker(tm) with Power Score added to Gear Score .. but I don't think that's the right solution.
     
  6. DragonLegend

    DragonLegend Well-Known Member

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    Screenshot_20181101-145020.png
    Looks like Numbers are trying to tell us something...
     
  7. xArrogance

    xArrogance Well-Known Member

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    That events that reward mass amounts of damage favor ships with more weapons .. interesting .. who woulda thunk
     
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  8. DragonLegend

    DragonLegend Well-Known Member

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    So will it be ok after event???
    Like i dont know whats going on.
     
  9. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe Moon's haunted

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    Lol agreed. Events are not a good time for looking at balance charts. Even I'm playing shooter despite being an enfo main:D
     
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  10. DragonLegend

    DragonLegend Well-Known Member

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    So shooter is best for events and quests and everything else. Sounds OP
     
  11. Agile Vanguard

    Agile Vanguard Well-Known Member

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    You disappointed me this update. Your target of 100% shooter is not reached. Solution: Buff all spam weapons and double shooter's red slots while nerfing the others. What could go wrong?

    While your at it, why don't you increase new ships price by 50,000 ship pieces and make each piece seperate for each boat?
     
  12. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe Moon's haunted

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    So speeder and enfo rock at CTF and ranked. Sounds OP?

    Look, all I'm trying to say is that this entire thing, what with all the arguments about ship balance I've been seeing lately, revolves around range. People may think shooters are OP and easy to play, but only the latter is true, and even that, only fractionally.

    Let me tell everyone here the truth about the shooter. As someone who's migrated a little bit to that side of the game from the enforcer and speeder.

    Shooters are strong. They are immensely, insanely, hopelessly strong beasts if engaged solo. You'll feel like you've been hit by a train if a shooter manages to unload his build into you.

    Enfos are strong. You mess with an enforcer, be it a speedforcer or a DB enfo, you're in for a world of pain. You'll see shots dropping on you with insane firepower focus, which is really visible if you have knifing builds. You'll find your attacks hitting uselessly or missing altogether, and at close range, you're gonna get locked down in a 1v1.

    Speeders are strong. They strike as suddenly as lightning and dissappear even faster. They hold the power to control the offensive in a 1v1.

    Notice the 1v1 part in each of those conparisons? Yeah. 1v1s and ships that excel in those situations, seem OP when one fights in those situations.

    I heard @xArrogance talk about how speeders should face as much risk as shooters when walking out in the open. My reply to that is that you're right.
    But we always face that threat, I'll be very honest here. There's no time to slack around, and with the power to move that fast, comes the need to control it. We face a lot of issues and are handicapped by low HP, low weapon count and stuff like that. Speeder is good and fun to play, don't get me wrong, but at a higher level, it is not nearly as versatile as shooter, and even that is not an issue.

    The issue is how much this game, as it is right now, is rewarding long range, behind-the-walls gameplay. I'm cool with long range, but if you're going to say that hiding behind the wall is now a thing, I don't like the way this game is going.

    Let me say that these are my personal feelings. And no, I'm not a speeder pro. I'm someone who loves speeder but hates being on the edge of a knife. I'm someone who has already decided that I have no nerve to main speeder. Just something to reflect on.
     
  13. xArrogance

    xArrogance Well-Known Member

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    I agree with most everything in that post.

    The thing I'll add is that I love playing the game .. and I want it to be balanced. I don't have some hidden agenda to make my life easier. I want to be able to play every ship and have the same chance of winning.


    I've played a fair amount of defender (pre-DB) and switch back and forth between shooter and speeder now .. and I'm working on my enfo build .. so I generally have an idea of what I'm talking about. It seems like many opinions come from people that haven't actually tried other ships.


    Anywho .. I don't like that the game is more like rock, paper, scissors now .. With skilled and equal teams, the match outcome is almost predetermined as soon as the teams are matched.

    Certain ships are hard counters to other ships and it takes a huge amount of skill difference or a large mistake to overcome those odds. Certain items are extremely strong against certain ships and utterly worthless against others.

    I would prefer every ship to have a equal chance against every other ship. I want items to have a balance between being super-effective and not effective at all - depending on the target.


    Obviously, I have some very detailed thoughts on how exactly that would work .. but I'll save that for another time.
     
  14. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe Moon's haunted

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    To put it simply, the issue we all seem to share is that situations where a given ship A has a fair chance against another ship B DO occur, based on factors like range, speed, armor, and control, BUT some of these factors are easier to attain/more likely to occur than others. This leads to these issues imho.
     
  15. Help I Cant Swim

    Help I Cant Swim MVP

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    That is simply impossible unless we are all running the same ship with the same setup. Otherwise, there will always be advantages based on ship type and setup.
     
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  16. TheAntiSnipe

    TheAntiSnipe Moon's haunted

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    I think he means that, "In certain set scenarios, every ship must stand a chance against every other ship"
     
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  17. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    I was hoping Interceptor would add some diversity to the game, having the second most weapons amongst all ships, but Rovio decided against mass adoption of it. We all know how under-represented Fixers are relative to their team value, and again Rovio decided The Reaper is also not for mass adoption. So much untapped potential in this game that I fear may never be seen.
     
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  18. Help I Cant Swim

    Help I Cant Swim MVP

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    What does that even mean?

    This whole argument makes no sense.

    This is how it is supposed to be. Not every ship is supposed to be a 1v1 champion. There's also tons of different combos that every ship can take.

    Every ship does stand an equal chance against every other ship. Not in 1v1, but in any given match, any 5 ships (for 99% of matches) stands an equal chance vs any 5 other ships (again, 99% of the time).

    The only way to have perfectly equal chances between ships in any situation (1v1, 3v3, 5v5) is for everyone to have the same ship. That is boring and not a MOBA. Certain ships must have advantages in different situations.

    confused.gif
     
  19. ViscountSniffit

    ViscountSniffit Well-Known Member

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    To be honest, I’ve been feeling the balance between ships has been much better since .4 (not sure about Defender), and I’m talking pre ‘balancing’ here.

    I’m happy to see Shooters finally lose their defence points. I never understood why they had that, and it was really annoying when you went ‘all in’ to finish a low health Shooter that you though you could kill, only to have him survive with 12 hp, and 10 seconds of free shots at you.

    I still think Shooter needs a ‘slight’ hp nerf. They are really fast and agile now. Talk about unregistered hits on Speeder, I get plenty of unregistered hits on Shooters now, with them wiggling about. That kind of speed and agility should come at a price, as it does for Speeders, I think the gap in hp ought to be reduced. Hopefully that would also encourage more Defender use for people who want a more tanky build.
     
  20. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    Because weapons offer huge damage now, and increasing every iteration, HP nerfs are not recommended. If you are thinking other boats need more HP that's an entirely different argument.

    For me there's no incentive to jump from Shooter to Defender... it would cost me 2 weapons for the HP, but I like buttons to press. Interceptor is the in-between ship that would make it possible for both Shooters and Defenders to transition easier... but being positioned as unobtainable by anyone but whales, that's just a balancing opportunity lost.
     

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