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statistically speaking, gaining infamy is impossible.

Discussion in 'Game Discussion' started by Alpakaa, 9 Mar 2019.

  1. Alpakaa

    Alpakaa Member

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    So we all know about infamy right? You get it from winning and lose it from losing in ranked matches. You may have also noticed most people, about 95% of the players have almost a 1:1 win/lose ratio. So that means we all usually win half of the time and lose the other half. We all know this. Let's say that somebody wins a game, then loses a game, then wins a game, then loses a game. And they can never win two battles in a row. This leads to them losing the infamy they have just gained from the previous round each game. They will, therefore, never gain infamy.

    So what's the point? What if you truly cannot win two battles in a row? Then infamy is pointless. It does not matter how many battles you have.. it only matter that you can take two steps forward and two steps back. Even the highest level NML players usually all have a 1:1 w/l ratio. So if everybody's ratio is the same, what really makes the difference between a NML player and a rookie? Statistically, nothing.

    Infamy is, therefore, only a representation of not how many battles you can win, but it is a measure of breaking out of the win once, lose once, repeat, kind of system. So according to obvious mathematics, it is literally impossible to gain infamy obviously. Unless, somebody loses a battle, then wins a battle, then wins a battle, then loses a battle, then wins again, then loses a battle, then wins and wins and wins again, but loses once again. Using this algorithm, we can decide that gaining infamy is literally impossible statistically speaking from a statistic point of view.
     
    Last edited: 11 Mar 2019
  2. NathanaelK

    NathanaelK Well-Known Member

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    You have to take draws into account. If the ratio is 1:1 win to not-win, and you have had ten draws, then your Infamy would be 240 (give or take a little bit for 23- or 25-Infamy games), no?
    If you have had 100 draws, then your Infamy would be 2400.
    I'm not saying this is the only method for gaining Infamy. In the beginning, for instance, you gain playing against bots. But it is one thing that affects this.

    I hope I didn't just take your 85%-joke thread too seriously…
     
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  3. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    Currently matchmaking is RNG, a coin's flip chance of winning. So this thread is no joke. :D
     
  4. JoshW

    JoshW Well-Known Member

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    It rarely ever happens this way, back when I was tracking my infamy it would be win streak after loss streak ending up with a net gain of about 48 infamy depending on how many battles I played.
     
    Sidd gamer likes this.
  5. TVNPryde

    TVNPryde Well-Known Member

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    Infamy is harder to gain now than ever because of the smaller fan base, especially the newer players. The devs been pumping infamy through new players playing against bots. Without new players, the pool of infamy keeps decreasing every time there is a a reset of season, even if we’re losing much less now.

    This is the problem with these devs. They've never considered pumping infamy into the pool any other way. There should be a +25/-24 after each ranked battle now. If the infamy pool gets inflated, the season reset will always balancing out. We need more infamy in the pool so players no longer worry about falling back a league. This will help ranked games.
     
    Nikkie! likes this.
  6. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    This is what I tend to see as well... lots of streaks

    I've never liked the per match Infamy adjustment. It is the root cause of the entire seal clubbing issue, which allows players to adjust their Infamy hundreds of points a day.. it's not realistic and not a proper representation of skill nor item strength. Player skill doesn't change over the course of hours, and neither does item strength in a significant way. If Infamy adjusted slowly over time absorbing the peaks and valleys from streaky matchmaking, players would not be afraid to play Infamy.

    OTOH, ranked is trash now... Infamy in individual matches span 2800 Infamy, which is not a proper ranked match. So let's face it, there's nothing you can do with per match Infamy adjustments until that issue is addressed, and if that can't be fixed, then just scrap Infamy.
     
  7. Aether_Zero

    Aether_Zero Well-Known Member

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    As a few folks would know from seeing me battle, I'm generally around 2500-2900 infamy. This last week, I've dipped below 2k for the first time in 6 months. I thought matchmaking around 2500 was screwy at times, but this is a whole new level of idiocy.
    I'm seeing people from captain level 38-50 in the same matches, infamy ranges from 200-3k IN THE SAME MATCH! How in any way, shape or form is this fair?! I know I'll get back to where I was with a bit of grinding, but I truly fear that new players who are just starting out are running into folks 10+ captain levels higher, with all the extra trainings that involves, and maxed epics to boot. Unless something is done, and done bloody soon, this game is going to collapse on itself. Where are the Devs? What's the overall plan? Why have I NEVER seen an ad for BB in other games?
    We as a player base deserve answers. Or am I barking up the wrong tree, and it's time to uninstall and walk away?
     
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  8. Su-57

    Su-57 Well-Known Member

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    If they fix Match making and Infamy progress this game can become way more better . people are saying remove casual but why they had to introduced Casual at first place . its because people don't wana lose infamy not in the way it works in this game . like someone going as high as 2-3k infamy then 1200-1000 . specially when sometimes players give their best in a battle but they lose . some higher ranked players in discord or in global chat say oh you don't wana lose battle you wana win every battle . but its not like that people don't care about losing in a fair battle but when they lose because match making put then in very unbalanced battles or sometimes just stopped their boat ( yes that also happened recent was in casual when my shooter stopped moving at all ) this game can manipulate results and people don't like that .

    I think they should stop introducing new items but fix the infamy system in a better way and also match making .
     
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  9. Guncaptain809

    Guncaptain809 Well-Known Member

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    Maybe a way to address this is make the infamy lost for losing only half of what it is now? Most other mobile games I've played do this.
     
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  10. Mimmel

    Mimmel Member

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    What we don't like is that we lose the same amount of infamy regardless you played well or were a floater. ROVIO tried to change this but well in a wrong way. The granual infamy was interpreted by them something different from what we have imagined. Thus it has been reverted quickly. So, I can see that they know that we are not happy with the current system, but don't know how. Though they do something similar already in events.... They seem to not be confident enough with the evaluation for ranked.
     
    Last edited: 11 Mar 2019
    Guncaptain809 likes this.
  11. benguin8

    benguin8 Well-Known Member

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    Too lazy to find my previous post on this same suggestion, but two steps forward one step back IS the way to go. So +25/-12. I would even take +25/-16. We will still get the same 50% win lose ratio but it will spread out players who have been playing a long time (hence have more resources, better gear) with those who just started and have low infamy. I just got demoted to Masters 3 yesterday because of infamy only to fine its mostly rare rewards with a sprinkle of epic. I need epics to progress to get my infamy back up! I need to get better infamy to get more powerful but I need to get more powerful to get better infamy. Stop the madness cycle!

    See the huge thread "the need to feel we are getting better" for countless other suggestions. Losing infamy is a punishment and losing sucks. Then you try to win based on your compatibility with 4 strangers. What could go wrong? A game must at least give the illusion that I am improving or else our weak self esteems are crushed.
     
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  12. TVNPryde

    TVNPryde Well-Known Member

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    That’s too much infamy. +25/-24 is good enough as in a long run, infamy will be more in a pool. Excess infamy in the pool will be wipe out at reset.

    @Guncaptain809, most others game reset everyone infamy to equal at the beginning of a season. I was planning to suggest that in the new players’ event.
     
  13. Su-57

    Su-57 Well-Known Member

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    the way ace player going down to 1000 or even 200-400 infamy its better if they just get rid of the infamy system because i don't think they are gonna fix it because current system is difficult to fix . they should find something else to show progress of the players and reward should be based on captain level .
     
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  14. envylife

    envylife Well-Known Member

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    Agreed... that ship has sailed.
     
  15. Earel

    Earel Active Member

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    So, if u have 50 lvl and warriors league u should recive same reward like a nightmare l player with 50 lvl also?)
    Bad idea at all...
    Infarmy - last part of the game that u can’t buy))
    U can buy all in this game... in one day... max all ships/items/lvl/perks ... u can buy all of this in one day... in 24 hours ) from noob to American marauder))
    So, u think it’s ok?.. and u And top player should recive same?!))) just LOL)
    If u can grows in infarmy... it’s mean u play bad. That’s all.
     
  16. Su-57

    Su-57 Well-Known Member

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    Look at this player he was over 3500infamy and he was there for long . he is playing this game for more then year but now his infamy is less then 1300 . do you think infamy really tell who is a good player or bad. i don't think so . there are some other player who are now at 200-400 infamy they also used to be over 3500 infamy and they were there for long . i don't think infamy represent who is good or bad player . i just played a event battle other team had fixer to heal . our team was winning i did 48k dmg that was more then unfriendly team players but just when battle was about to finish my team mates with low hp decided to run into unfriendly they did and 7-5 win turn into 7-8 lose ..this kind of things used to happened in Ranked when team mate just take some decision which make winnable battle a lose and you get -24 . how can this really show if someone is a good player or bad .
     

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  17. benguin8

    benguin8 Well-Known Member

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    Agree with so many points here. Infamy is a good scale of your skill in the beginning, but as you get higher, there are some slippery slopes. And yes I think I should get rewards based on my highest infamy ever, and not necessarily on where I am. How can I get better with rare rewards when I am trying to level epic weapons?

    Anyway, I wrote a big long response to this and it evolved into a new system of sorts. So I ended up making a new thread to keep it separate from this one. Check it out and see if a happy compromise might not be found somewhere.
    https://forum.battlebay.net/threads/how-to-compare-players-infamy-matchmaking-solution.24670/
     
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