Fire Calculations or Perks Percents need adjustments

TL;DR: The way that fire damage is calculated is making perk descriptions misleading.

In reality, if you look at fire and damage perks on the same scale, your four Fire perks (48%) are increasing your damage by around 112% .. Or your four Damage perks (32%) are only increasing your damage by around 16%.

So, there is no case to be made for using event legendary cannon perks (much less traditional damage perks) over epic fire perks.





The fire damage calculation is either:

(a) making perk descriptions misleading or
(b) not working as intended.


(a) If the calculation is working as intended, then the perks should be relabeled (for more accurate perk descriptions). With perk labels on the same scale, players will better understand the actual difference between perks.

• Damage perks should list 4% damage (rather than 8%), or
• Fire perks should list 28% (rather than 12%)

Why? The perk bonus is applied at different stages of the calculation: 8% damage perks are added to the talent bonus multiplier, while burning perks are multiplied separately.

This change in the perk labels/description would not affect the formula numbers or how damage is calculated, but would be a more accurate description of the actual difference between the two.

Spoiler: CALCULATIONS

8% DAMAGE PERKS
Max Epic BC, Normal Damage, 0 perks
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94%) = 1368
Max Epic BC, Normal Damage, Four 8% Damage perks
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94% + (8% × 4)) = 1593

1593 - 1368 = 225 ÷ 4 = 56.25
56.25 ÷ 1368 = 4% increase in damage per perk

12% FIRE PERKS
Max Epic BC, Burning Target, Four 12% Fire perks
Current Calculation:
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94%) × (1 + 20% + (12% × 4)) = 2298

** If we place Fire Perks on the same scale as Damage Perks (added rather than multiplied), how much is damage increased)? **

(690 + 15) × (1 + 94% + 20% + 112%) = 2298
112% ÷ 4 = 28% increase in damage per perk

Where do the numbers come from?
Max Epic BC:
Base: 690 + 15 (Crew talents)
Crew Bonus: 94%
Perk Bonus: 32% (for damage perks), 48% (for fire perks)
Fire Bonus: 20% (Crew talents)

In other words ... the scale between 8% damage and 12% Fire Damage is different - and the damage increase is dramatically different.

To put them on the same scale, either:
8% Damage perks would be calculated like this ..

• 705 × 1.94 × 1.32 (rather than 705 × (1.94 + 1.32)).

Or, 12% Fire perks would be calculated like this ..

• 705 × (1.94 + .68) (rather than 705 × 1.94 × 1.68)

(b) If the fire damage calculation is working differently than intended - as I hope - then the calculation should be changed.

How fire damage is currently calculated:

• Base × (Crew + Perk Multiplier) × Fire Bonus Multiplier

[Or more detail]

• (Base + Crew Base) × (1 + Crew Bonus Percentage + Perk Percentage) × (1 + Fire Bonus Percentage)

How fire damage should be calculated:

• Base × (Crew + Perk + Fire Bonus Multiplier)

[Or more detail]

• (Base + Crew Base) × (1 + Crew Bonus Percentage + Perk Percentage + Fire Bonus Percentage)

Base numbers could be adjusted to keep maximum damage at the same level - if the current numbers are where devs think they should be.


However, I believe the current calculation is the cause of a few issues in the game:

1) Cannon Damage Perks are severely underpowered compared to Fire Damage Perks - even legendary cannon perks. What's worse is that some/most players do not realize the potential damage they are giving up by using event perks.

(Yes, there is "risk" involved in having a non-burning opponent, but it's not exactly difficult to ignite opponents nor keep them burning for long periods of time).

2) E-cannons have received several nerfs directly because of how fire damage is calculated - when its damage, cooldown, range, speed was not the issue. The issue was the EC hitting burning targets for the same damage as the much more difficult to use, 20-second CD rail gun (~2700 damage).

With the agility update, and blast cannon and grenade popularity rising, it is only a matter of time before they start being nerfed as well.

3) Weapons that burn opponents or receive fire bonuses will remain the meta (and most used) weapons. Other weapons, even the new gatling gun, will never compete with fire weapons without severe balance changes.

4) All formulas should treat bonuses the same way in strategic games for accuracy, balancing, and player planning. Arcade games, where certain characters are meant to be stronger than others, can get away with this randomness, but that's not how I've viewed BB - to this point anyways.

Spoiler: BC/EC Calcs - Current & Suggested Formula:

Max Epic BC: Current Calculation
Normal Damage, 8% Damage perks
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94% + (8% × 4)) = 1593
Burning Target, 8% Damage perks
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94% + (8% × 4)) × (1 + 20%) = 1912

Normal Damage, 12% Fire perks
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94%) = 1368
Burning Target, 12% Fire perks
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94%) × (1 + 20% + (12% × 4)) = 2298

Max Epic BC: Revised Calculation*
Normal Damage, 8% Damage perks
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94% + (8% × 4)) = 1593
Burning Target
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94% + 20% + (8% × 4)) = 1734

Normal Damage, 12% Fire perks
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94%) = 1368
Burning Target, 12% Fire perks
(690 + 15) × (1 + 94% + 20% + (12% × 4)) = 1847



Max Epic EC: Current Calculation
Normal Damage, 8% Damage perks
(824 + 15) × (1 + 0.91 + (0.08 × 4)) = 1871
Burning Target, 8% Damage perks
(824 + 15) × (1 + 0.91 + (0.08 × 4)) × (1 + 0.20) = 2245

Normal Damage, 12% Fire perks
(824 + 15) × (1 + 0.91) = 1602
Burning Target, 12% Fire perks
(824 + 15) × (1 + 0.91) × (1 + 0.20 + (0.12 × 4)) = 2692

Max Epic EC: Revised Calculation*
Normal Damage, 8% Damage perks
(824 + 15) × (1 + 0.91 + (0.08 × 4)) = 1871
Burning Target, 8% Damage perks
(824 + 15) × (1 + 0.91 + 0.20 + (0.08 × 4)) = 2039

Normal Damage, 12% Fire perks
(824 + 15) × (1 + 0.91) = 1602
Burning Target, 12% Fire perks
(824 + 15) × (1 + 0.91 + 0.20 + (0.12 × 4)) = 2173

*Assuming no change in base stats.

Spoiler: Why it took this long for me to notice ...?

First off, as I said, the perk descriptions are misleading.

Otherwise, I used to always use damage perks on my EC in order to pop TShields for a 1-to-1 trade. Then, Tshield HP perks came along. As more top Enfos collected HP perks, there was less and less of a reason to use damage perks .. so I switched to fire perks.

Imagine my surprise when my EC damage went from 1871 damage to almost 2700 (when I expected 2200)!

I saw people calculate fire damage in this way on the forums, but thought they had to be mistaken. How does it make sense to multiply fire perks by the entire damage of the weapon when straight damage perks (and all other perks) are only multipled by the base number? It didn't ... and still doesn't.

Imagine if range, cooldown, fixing, crit percentage/damage perks were calculated in this way ... they would quickly become the most used perks in the game.

But ... I've learned to throw out my common sense notions of how formulas should be set up and started looking at other formulas as well. I imagine frost has the same issues as fire.

And, I'm curious to see how OB is calculated - if it is multiplied or added to the speed calculation. Does it have any affect on acceleration or reverse speed? Is that why many top yellow boats are able to forgo the turbo to boosting their health and/or repairing to levels near or above shooters, while maintaining their agility, acceleration, and speed advantages?

It's a smart strategy - using the smaller hit-box boat, that's faster and more agility, with more HPs and/or repairing than shooters. Obviously, there is a weapon number disadvantage, but that's easy enough to mitigate with speed (e.g., you're out of range or behind cover before they can use their extra weapons). But, I'm curious what drawbacks there are, if any ... stay tuned.

 

Wow! Ur really good at analyzing things. U should join some discord group with the Devs to discuss with them personally regarding these matters. These are some really good observations.