With this update, the devs have showcased an astounding lack of understanding of their own game

[QUOTE = "Epicular, post: 172835, member: 5879"] Casi todos en este foro han dado su granito de arena por la "Actualización de agilidad". Hasta ahora, la respuesta ha sido abrumadoramente negativa, con la queja principal de que los barcos de los jugadores son casi imposibles de controlar.

Si bien esa es una queja válida, las consecuencias de los cambios introducidos en esta actualización son mucho más profundas que la dificultad de control. Porque el problema de control es uno que se arreglará con el tiempo; los jugadores se adaptarán naturalmente a la nueva sensación de los movimientos y el mundo seguirá girando. Algunos otros han señalado problemas mucho peores con la actualización, y eso es lo que estoy aquí para enfatizar.

Veamos, ¿por dónde empezamos?

Balance issues galore
Como creador de BayStats, soy uno de los que critica con frecuencia a los desarrolladores por problemas evidentes de equilibrio en su juego. Pero aprecio el servicio que los desarrolladores realizan para nosotros, los jugadores. Todavía los apoyo en sus esfuerzos por mejorar el juego. Sin embargo, desde una perspectiva de equilibrio, su decisión de cambiar bruscamente la base del juego que han estado tratando de equilibrar durante años parece ser, en el mejor de los casos, muy equivocada.

The way in which ships can move dictates the power of ALL weapons in the game, because each weapon is unique in how they connect with their targets. Part of the core balance of the game depends on projectile speed and overall ease of damage output. Mortars require slow targets; torpedoes and slow-moving cannon projectiles require less agile targets; fast-moving cannon projectiles generally don't care. But since each weapon is unique in this sense, once you've changed the core movement mechanics, all of the game's balance is completely out the window.

• Now that ships can turn at a moment's notice, how much less useful will Mortars become?
• What about torpedoes? With super-agile ships, will they be even remotely viable anymore?
• Won't slow-moving cannon projectiles become even more frustrating to use?
• Carronade's turret-slowing ability is the only thing that made it useful in knife fights against slower ships, what will happen to that?
• Will fast-moving projectile weapons suffer any of the same consequences as the above item families?

All of this seems to have been either completely overlooked or ignored by the developers. This just shows me that they either don't value a balanced gameplay experience, or that they don't even have a basic grasp on how balancing works in their game.

The developers' reactions to Gear Lube and Rudder being underused is appalling
With their update, the developers told us: "Gear Lube and Rudder are the least used items in the game. So we just deleted them completely!"

...what?

...are you kidding me?!

Are the developers really so obscenely incompetent at balancing their own game that they just deleted two of their only six blue items, on the simple grounds that they were weak? Do they not know that one option is to change Gear Lube and Rudder to be more useful? They had plenty of options for doing this, and the community had no short supply of ideas for such options. Instead, we just made the blue-item selection process more monotonous! Hooray...

So what will happen if people continue to ignore frost items? Will we simply remove them from the game, and make all ships slower? What if everyone stops using Turbo - will we remove Turbo and make all ships faster? The logic that the developers employed for their removal of Gear Lube and Rudder is truly scary, because it is causing a regression in the overall player experience and in the diversity of items and ship abilities.

I get that the developers didn't exclusively state item usage as their grounds for removing Gear Lube and Rudder, but the rest of their reasoning was equally worthless. See below...

An entire layer of strategy has been lost
What makes Battle Bay unique? It certainly isn't the selection of weaponry or ship types, and it definitely isn't the combat dynamic of aiming and shooting at things. Those can be found in just about any 3D shooter game ever.

What makes Battle Bay unique is the depth of strategy:

• Rolling waves that can be used as cover
• Mindfulness of the map's obstacle, and the level of cover that each of them provide
• Awareness of the positions of teammates and enemies
• Strategic ship positioning and orientation, relative to all of the above listed elements

Now that ships can spin and change direction on a dime, a great deal of that strategy has been completely killed off. I am not exaggerating with that statement. What's the point of strategic positioning if my position can be changed in near-immediate fashion? How am I supposed to outplay my opponents by taking advantage of their poor positioning, when their position can be so rapidly changed? What about Speeders who used to run circles around less agile opponents - how are they supposed to leverage their speed advantage? It's really a shame to watch all of this strategic depth fall away due to a thoroughly misguided effort to make the game more "fun".

The rest of the developers' reasoning for eliminating Gear Lube and Rudder was that slow turret and turning speeds worsened the game experience. But once again, this is woefully ignorant of the entire strategic foundation of the game. Since slow ship movement, like what Defender has, makes the game less fun to play, then why haven't they maxed the speeds of all ships? In fact, why not give everyone max HP because that's more "fun"! Again, the logic that the developers have used to justify their actions in this case is quite scary, because of how truly flawed it is.

Maybe the definition of "fun" for the developers is giving the players more power over their own ship, and that's a stance that I don't totally disagree with. But things like maxing ship agility goes both ways in terms of player empowerment!! Now that all ships are more mobile, every single shot from every single weapon is now automatically harder to land on those ships. Any empowerment gained from increased agility will be entirely cancelled out by the difficulty of actually hitting our targets.

All of this nonsense from the developers really stands out to me as a complete and astounding lack of understanding of their own game. When I first played this game, I thought that the amount of strategy involved in combat was all part of a genius concept by the developers. But as time has gone on, and the developers have proven their incapability of grasping what actually makes their own game unique, I am now under the impression that this game concept was never some genius plot to make a strategy-based game. Rather, I believe that they stumbled upon it in a random stroke of luck, and that the actions they are taking now are all part of their misplaced sense that they are actually improving the game.

Solution
The damage being caused to the game and its community right now is not irredeemable! There are steps that can be taken to keep this game moving in a positive direction, and although the deletion of Gear Lube and Rudder is now fairly permanent, all is not yet lost.

1) Significantly reduce the turret and turning speeds of all ships
A small buff was probably warranted given the deletion of Gear Lube and Rudder, but the maxing out of agility was completely unnecessary and should be reverted ASAP before more problems are caused by another significant change. Sliders to adjust agility are not a downright terrible idea, but it's the wrong solution for this problem.

2) Actively attempt to maintain game balance
Últimamente se han producido cambios en el equilibrio una vez en una luna azul; a ese ritmo, nunca nos recuperaremos de estos cambios. Los desarrolladores deben intensificarlo para garantizar que se entregue una experiencia completa.

3) En realidad escucha a la comunidad
Este es siempre un truco que no sé cómo los desarrolladores (de muchos juegos diferentes) continuamente lo pierden. Realmente no es difícil simplemente escuchar los comentarios de tus jugadores, incluso si no te gustan los comentarios. Si este paso se hubiera seguido desde el principio, ¡ciertamente no estaríamos en este lío!

Realmente no tengo ninguna razón para creer que se tomarán ninguno de estos pasos, ¡pero uno siempre puede esperar!

Gracias por leer: estaré aquí esperando la próxima actualización que nos proporcione pilotos automáticos completos para disparar Y movernos, ¡para que ni siquiera tengamos que pelearnos tediosamente! / s [/ QUOTE]
Totalmente de acuerdo con amigo mío: v tú si sabes expresarte bro, te apte apoyo y espero que pronto los creadores de Battle Bay arreglen el problema con la actualización

 

[QUOTE = "Epicular, post: 172835, member: 5879"] Casi todos en este foro han dado su granito de arena por la "Actualización de agilidad". Hasta ahora, la respuesta ha sido abrumadoramente negativa, con la queja principal de que los barcos de los jugadores son casi imposibles de controlar.

Si bien esa es una queja válida, las consecuencias de los cambios introducidos en esta actualización son mucho más profundas que la dificultad de control. Porque el problema de control es uno que se arreglará con el tiempo; los jugadores se adaptarán naturalmente a la nueva sensación de los movimientos y el mundo seguirá girando. Algunos otros han señalado problemas mucho peores con la actualización, y eso es lo que estoy aquí para enfatizar.

Veamos, ¿por dónde empezamos?

Equilibrar problemas en abundancia
Como creador de BayStats, soy uno de los que critica con frecuencia a los desarrolladores por problemas evidentes de equilibrio en su juego. Pero aprecio el servicio que los desarrolladores realizan para nosotros, los jugadores. Todavía los apoyo en sus esfuerzos por mejorar el juego. Sin embargo, desde una perspectiva de equilibrio, su decisión de cambiar bruscamente la base del juego que han estado tratando de equilibrar durante años parece ser, en el mejor de los casos, muy equivocada.

The way in which ships can move dictates the power of ALL weapons in the game, because each weapon is unique in how they connect with their targets. Part of the core balance of the game depends on projectile speed and overall ease of damage output. Mortars require slow targets; torpedoes and slow-moving cannon projectiles require less agile targets; fast-moving cannon projectiles generally don't care. But since each weapon is unique in this sense, once you've changed the core movement mechanics, all of the game's balance is completely out the window.

• Now that ships can turn at a moment's notice, how much less useful will Mortars become?
• What about torpedoes? With super-agile ships, will they be even remotely viable anymore?
• Won't slow-moving cannon projectiles become even more frustrating to use?
• Carronade's turret-slowing ability is the only thing that made it useful in knife fights against slower ships, what will happen to that?
• Will fast-moving projectile weapons suffer any of the same consequences as the above item families?

All of this seems to have been either completely overlooked or ignored by the developers. This just shows me that they either don't value a balanced gameplay experience, or that they don't even have a basic grasp on how balancing works in their game.

The developers' reactions to Gear Lube and Rudder being underused is appalling
With their update, the developers told us: "Gear Lube and Rudder are the least used items in the game. So we just deleted them completely!"

...what?

...are you kidding me?!

Are the developers really so obscenely incompetent at balancing their own game that they just deleted two of their only six blue items, on the simple grounds that they were weak? Do they not know that one option is to change Gear Lube and Rudder to be more useful? They had plenty of options for doing this, and the community had no short supply of ideas for such options. Instead, we just made the blue-item selection process more monotonous! Hooray...

So what will happen if people continue to ignore frost items? Will we simply remove them from the game, and make all ships slower? What if everyone stops using Turbo - will we remove Turbo and make all ships faster? The logic that the developers employed for their removal of Gear Lube and Rudder is truly scary, because it is causing a regression in the overall player experience and in the diversity of items and ship abilities.

I get that the developers didn't exclusively state item usage as their grounds for removing Gear Lube and Rudder, but the rest of their reasoning was equally worthless. See below...

An entire layer of strategy has been lost
What makes Battle Bay unique? It certainly isn't the selection of weaponry or ship types, and it definitely isn't the combat dynamic of aiming and shooting at things. Those can be found in just about any 3D shooter game ever.

What makes Battle Bay unique is the depth of strategy:

• Rolling waves that can be used as cover
• Mindfulness of the map's obstacle, and the level of cover that each of them provide
• Awareness of the positions of teammates and enemies
• Strategic ship positioning and orientation, relative to all of the above listed elements

Now that ships can spin and change direction on a dime, a great deal of that strategy has been completely killed off. I am not exaggerating with that statement. What's the point of strategic positioning if my position can be changed in near-immediate fashion? How am I supposed to outplay my opponents by taking advantage of their poor positioning, when their position can be so rapidly changed? What about Speeders who used to run circles around less agile opponents - how are they supposed to leverage their speed advantage? It's really a shame to watch all of this strategic depth fall away due to a thoroughly misguided effort to make the game more "fun".

The rest of the developers' reasoning for eliminating Gear Lube and Rudder was that slow turret and turning speeds worsened the game experience. But once again, this is woefully ignorant of the entire strategic foundation of the game. Since slow ship movement, like what Defender has, makes the game less fun to play, then why haven't they maxed the speeds of all ships? In fact, why not give everyone max HP because that's more "fun"! Again, the logic that the developers have used to justify their actions in this case is quite scary, because of how truly flawed it is.

Maybe the definition of "fun" for the developers is giving the players more power over their own ship, and that's a stance that I don't totally disagree with. But things like maxing ship agility goes both ways in terms of player empowerment!! Now that all ships are more mobile, every single shot from every single weapon is now automatically harder to land on those ships. Any empowerment gained from increased agility will be entirely cancelled out by the difficulty of actually hitting our targets.

All of this nonsense from the developers really stands out to me as a complete and astounding lack of understanding of their own game. When I first played this game, I thought that the amount of strategy involved in combat was all part of a genius concept by the developers. But as time has gone on, and the developers have proven their incapability of grasping what actually makes their own game unique, I am now under the impression that this game concept was never some genius plot to make a strategy-based game. Rather, I believe that they stumbled upon it in a random stroke of luck, and that the actions they are taking now are all part of their misplaced sense that they are actually improving the game.

Solution
The damage being caused to the game and its community right now is not irredeemable! There are steps that can be taken to keep this game moving in a positive direction, and although the deletion of Gear Lube and Rudder is now fairly permanent, all is not yet lost.

1) Significantly reduce the turret and turning speeds of all ships
A small buff was probably warranted given the deletion of Gear Lube and Rudder, but the maxing out of agility was completely unnecessary and should be reverted ASAP before more problems are caused by another significant change. Sliders to adjust agility are not a downright terrible idea, but it's the wrong solution for this problem.

2) Actively attempt to maintain game balance
Últimamente se han producido cambios en el equilibrio una vez en una luna azul; a ese ritmo, nunca nos recuperaremos de estos cambios. Los desarrolladores deben intensificarlo para garantizar que se entregue una experiencia completa.

3) En realidad escucha a la comunidad
Este es siempre un truco que no sé cómo los desarrolladores (de muchos juegos diferentes) continuamente lo pierden. Realmente no es difícil simplemente escuchar los comentarios de tus jugadores, incluso si no te gustan los comentarios. Si este paso se hubiera seguido desde el principio, ¡ciertamente no estaríamos en este lío!

Realmente no tengo ninguna razón para creer que se tomarán ninguno de estos pasos, ¡pero uno siempre puede esperar!

Gracias por leer: estaré aquí esperando la próxima actualización que nos proporcione pilotos automáticos completos para disparar Y movernos, ¡para que ni siquiera tengamos que pelearnos tediosamente! / s [/ QUOTE]
Aunque creó que hubiera estado chévere un barco MK 8 y armas con una sexta categoría.

 

You win the Internet.... that's the perfect description! The Coca-Cola company is putting "Original Formula" on their cans 33 years after that "taste tested" debacle. Battle Bay will not be able to shake this massive oversight if it isn't corrected this week.

 

All excellent points that will be ignored. Now prepare to be accused of crying and told to leave the game by noobs with 1500 infamy and 4 months into the game.

 

Whats funny is Coke actually did taste tests and it polled better than this update is currently.

 

Dude, I've seen you on so many threads with all of these posts --- if you're not happy with it, leave. You keep saying 'all' and referencing some forum poll with what, 100 to 200 responses for a game that has thousands over thousands of users. You don't speak for everyone and that poll barely means a thing. The numbers aren't significant considering they are biased - coming from a forum that's been (generally) full of angry people for months now. I've played this game for a year and have played every day but just recently joined the forum - not everyone is on here even if they are die-hard, so it's hardly a full representation of the full BB population.

That's not how product development works, software, game, or otherwise. Unless you're pulling numbers from responses to surveys that are handled In-game, it doesn't mean a thing, especially to anyone who is getting paid to make this game successful. Do you think that anyone whose job depends on this success of the game is purposefully tanking it? Please. They're looking at usage numbers, VIP rates, frequency.

Do I think the update is perfect? No. Am I happy with increased agility? Yes. Do I think they messed up the damage for the new weapon? Absolutely. Am I confused as to how that got through testing? Definitely. Do I think they'll correct it? Yes. If I didn't, I'd say my peace, wait to see if it changed, and then get out.

It's awesome to share your feedback, good or bad. Say your peace and then let them do what they're going to do. If you're not happy with it, take your time and your cash somewhere else. But at this point people are just getting rude. There is a team full of people behind this who are always the absolute last to receive praise but the first to get absolutely fucking drilled by people. It could be one singular person making these decisions you hate but you're coming after everyone with those types of comments. I get it, keyboard warriors don't care and I'm sure you'll just tell me I'm nuts or boast about how you probably have a higher infamy than me, but I do feel compelled to stand up for people when things are going too far.

You're pissed and expecting a change - acknowledged. Let them do their work and then either shit or get off the pot. There's a line between making your feelings known and being obnoxious about it, and a decent amount of people crossed that line a while ago. If you're THAT pressed, just go.

 

It's a good concept to raise agility
What is the big complaint is how far this has gone. Probably splitting the difference will be a good start.

But yes...any agility boost is a new mechanical game. Remember the 3vs3 where all boats and agility was improved 15 percent. Devs this would have been the move to do. A raise of everything by a percentage. 15 to 25. Is a world most players could live with. Ps. That 3vs3 event was a hands down community favorite. @Weeze @American Marauder
@The Grim Repair

 

100% agree. The agility differences between ships were balanced before (mostly), but now you can almost instantaneously turn your turret at someone or turn around, so small differences don't matter as much.

 

It’s been a long time since I’ve seen so many likes for one post. Nice creating a solid and easy to understand argument.

 

Loving the in depth analysis and articulating the issues on a point by point basis for 200% clarity! Most of us are on the same page as you are and I would like to reiterate what you’ve mentioned with regards to how/why I came to love Battle Bay and it being the only phone game I’ve ever seriously played:
The game actually requires skills/ thinking/ decision making/ and understanding to actually excel and be good in it- leading your shots, anticipating movements, kiting for survival, tactical positioning and plenty more. With the massive boost in terms of agility and turret speed, this makes a huge portion of the skilled plays to be almost obsolete, thus turning it into another no brainer typical game like the others. Devs, please seriously hear our pleads and adjust accordingly to bring back life to the bay as it’s been previously

 

this update just tells us 2 things
either
1.developers itself don't play this game.
2.they released an untested update to public.

 

I love people demanding others leave accusing me of being angry or crying or emotional. Projection at it's finest. I have an opinion and Im going to express it, if you don't like it then I don't what to tell you.

 

I agree with this.
The ships should have their own uniqueness. The game balance and strategy have been changed over night. I'm sure rovio is too money hungry to allow us to keep our parts and items and gold from the useless lubes and perks, but they should create a very adjustable sensitivity setting for ship/turret agility in the control menu

 

This is so heavily biased that I don't know where to start ..

You're hiding the fact that shooters and defenders are closer to an even playing field than ever before behind the facade of logic and blatant insults.

You say it's incompetence. I say it's the best step towards a balanced game that I've seen since I started playing BB. Adjustments will have to be made, no doubt, but it is a leap in the right direction.

 

The ship balance was fine, I use all 5, and primary the least popular Defender. If anything Tesla shield needed adjusting because of enforcers using 2 at higher levels. Just because the majority of people use shooter doesn't mean it's overpowered, theyre the least of my concern generally in matches, they tend to be lower skilled players.

This update was not about balance, it was about removing rudder and lube from the game because nobody used it. The solution was simply to combine them, now we have this mess where no matter what a percentage of people will be unhappy. The game is fundamentally altered to the point where I never seen so many people willing to quit and that hurts the whole community matchmaking.

 

from a balance perspective, their decision to abruptly change the foundation of the game that they've been trying to balance for years appears to be, at best, sorely misguided.

Disagree. More on that later.

The way in which ships can move dictates the power of ALL weapons in the game, because each weapon is unique in how they connect with their targets. Part of the core balance of the game depends on projectile speed and overall ease of damage output.

Agree. So, if ships have the advantage of being more mobile and this dictates the power of ALL weapons in the game, then the best step towards a balanced game would be reduce the enormous gap between the movement of different ship types - which sounds like a great step towards balancing.

Mortars require slow targets; torpedoes and slow-moving cannon projectiles require less agile targets.
Now that ships can turn at a moment's notice, how much less useful will Mortars become?
What about torpedoes? With super-agile ships, will they be even remotely viable anymore?

"Slow targets" "less agile targets" .. So you're upset that shooters, defenders and fixers are less helpless against the items that have never been effective against yellow boats? Sounds like balance to me ..

I haven't had any issue hitting with my big torp post update - in fact, I believe I'm hitting with it more often. But, feel free to advocate for another speed increase.

Mortars are primarily used by shooters against shooters or defenders, so why are you so concerned with shooter vs shooter/defender interactions? They are the ones enjoying this update the most.

It might be slightly easier to avoid at an angle, but they didn't get a speed boost. I'm still getting hit by mortars. A flight time adjustment is easy enough to make, if necessary .. I don't see this as such a game breaking issue.

Won't slow-moving cannon projectiles become even more frustrating to use?

More frustrating than they already were against yellow boats??? Not really .. Shooters, defenders and fixers are still easy to hit .. it may be less guaranteed, but it's more balanced now imo.

Carronade's turret-slowing ability is the only thing that made it useful in knife fights against slower ships, what will happen to that?

I rarely see Carronades since the defense perk came out .. but it's still going to be an advantage to slow a turret.

Will fast-moving projectile weapons suffer any of the same consequences as the above item families?

It might be harder to hit at max range with a sniper .. Are you suggesting that's a bad thing? Should sniper and rails get a speed boost?

All of this seems to have been either completely overlooked or ignored by the developers. This just shows me that they either don't value a balanced gameplay experience, or that they don't even have a basic grasp on how balancing works in their game.

Are the developers really so obscenely incompetent at balancing their own game that they just deleted two of their only six blue items, on the simple grounds that they were weak?

Wow ... Once a debate resorts to insults, an argument is lost.

Opinions may vary, but it's easy to see the logic in the changes - assuming you're not blinded by emotion.

So what will happen if people continue to ignore frost items? Will we simply remove them from the game, and make all ships slower?

Not likely. But, as much as people hate getting them over the yellow items they really want, I'm sure some wouldn't mind.

Slippery Slope Fallacy - asserting that a relatively small first step inevitably leads to a chain of related events culminating in some significant impact/event that should not happen, thus the first step should not happen.

What if everyone stops using Turbo - will we remove Turbo and make all ships faster?

Or, more likely, what if the turbo use rate was 100%, why not make all ships faster?

Although, honestly, I wouldn't mind. Shields and Bandages give you enough options to customize a ship to your needs ... and I had a terrible time RNGing turbos.

The logic that the developers employed for their removal of Gear Lube and Rudder is truly scary, because it is causing a regression in the overall player experience and in the diversity of items and ship abilities.

There were far more complaints about getting epic/legendary rudder and lubes, and the usage rate was virtually zero .. so I don't find the logic scary. It makes perfect sense. There has been no material change in item diversity post-update. And, O would argue that player experience has been enhanced since it's easier to get the items you want.

I get that the developers didn't exclusively state item usage as their grounds for removing Gear Lube and Rudder, but the rest of their reasoning was equally worthless. See below...

I suppose that's one way to go -- rather than trying to understand the logic and debating that, you could just call the reasoning "worthless."

An entire layer of strategy has been lost
What makes Battle Bay unique is the depth of strategy:
Rolling waves that can be used as cover
Mindfulness of the map's obstacle, and the level of cover that each of them provide
Awareness of the positions of teammates and enemies
Strategic ship positioning and orientation, relative to all of the above listed elements

I agree. And, now all ships can enjoy this uniqueness.

Now that ships can spin and change direction on a dime, a great deal of that strategy has been completely killed off. I am not exaggerating with that statement.

So rather than speeding behind a lethargic defender, hitting them 2-3 times before they can turn around, driving through their ship to the opposite side of their turret, hitting them 2-3 more times, over and over... You have to take your shot and move to cover ...? And, this takes less strategy?

Or, does it make the game more balanced and fair to allow ships a chance at defending themselves? With yellow speed items, there is nothing a defender can do to stop a yellow boat from getting behind him .. This isn't strategy. It's shooting fish in a barrel.

What's the point of strategic positioning if my position can be changed in near-immediate fashion? How am I supposed to outplay my opponents by taking advantage of their poor positioning, when their position can be so rapidly changed?

As in teleporting across the map? Or turret placement? Because, as I said, you can be in a terrible position as a speeder, hit the nitro and instantly have the advantage against a ship that takes forever to turn around... These changes are sounding more and more logical to me.

What about Speeders who used to run circles around less agile opponents - how are they supposed to leverage their speed advantage? It's really a shame to watch all of this strategic depth fall away due to a thoroughly misguided effort to make the game more "fun".

I believe it will be more fair and less fun for some. It's less fun to have a balanced match for some, but it is more fair. The speeder circle of death was nothing more than a game of keep away from the slow, fat kid. Now they have to work a little bit harder. This should increase the strategic depth of the game.

The rest of the developers' reasoning for eliminating Gear Lube and Rudder was that slow turret and turning speeds worsened the game experience. But once again, this is woefully ignorant of the entire strategic foundation of the game.

"Woefully ignorant" .... ok

Since slow ship movement, like what Defender has, makes the game less fun to play, then why haven't they maxed the speeds of all ships? In fact, why not give everyone max HP because that's more "fun"! Again, the logic that the developers have used to justify their actions in this case is quite scary, because of how truly flawed it is.

You said earlier how important ship movement was for balance, so I'm not seeing how you find balance changes to movement scary. If, however, they used slippery slope arguments like this to justify their logic, I would be scared.

All of this nonsense from the developers really stands out to me as a complete and astounding lack of understanding of their own game.
But as time has gone on, and the developers have proven their incapability of grasping what actually makes their own game unique
Rather, I believe that they stumbled upon it in a random stroke of luck, and that the actions they are taking now are all part of their misplaced sense that they are actually improving the game.

Yeah .. This pretty much sums up the entire post for me. It's a rant. I tried my best to find the logic in there but it's 95% insults and slippery slope arguments.

For those of you "liking" his post - whether you agree with the rant or not - make sure you're really looking for the arguments. It's a good habit to get in to.

Solution
3) Actually listen to the community
This one is always such a gimme that I don't know how developers (from many different games) continually miss it. It really isn't difficult to just listen to the feedback of your players, even if you don't like the feedback. If this step had been followed from the beginning, we certainly wouldn't be in this mess!

Dear developers; please don't.

I see now why your comments are infrequent. There is no reasoning with this type of stance. Whether I fully agree with all the changes or not, I see your logic and appreciate your hard work.

 

About combining the Gear lube and Rudder idea. lets assume it happened who enfo and fixer couldn't use it anyway so Bad Idea.
there is no doubt that agility is overboard now but going back to normal isnt the best option either.
here are the few things I have noticed after the update:
1. increased efficiency of frost
2. better 1v1 fights i.e its no longer only who got the more damaging weapons anymore
3. better defender
My Opinion on what it should be like:
Agility definitely needs a Nerf.
What Kind of Nerf??
1. Previous Version- NO
2. Slider - NO ( everyone will try to use max one and it still be hard for aiming since enemy will be using it putting u at disadvantage)
3 fix percent nerf for all ships- No ( current situation has blurred the Roles, ships are different why decrease should be same)
4. A Tailor made Nerf for all Ships according to the roles and capability of each ship.

 

Like talent training we had? Select if you want. If not select the care package.

 

IMO -- This issue is resolved with Sensitivity Sliders - almost every FPS game has this option. For anyone familiar with computer FPSs, very few have these setting maximized. It's more about finding the settings that feel most natural while also giving you full control.

Most ships are in a sweet spot now, so messing with all ships bc one is too high isn't ideal.

The other reason for this issue has a lot to do with tracking speed (agility + turret rotation). With too high of a tracking speed, like on the enforcer, the ship becomes difficult to control. IMO, there should be somewhat of an inverse relationship (i.e., more agility, less turret speed), which would make ships easier to control with the new camera/movement system and the old system.

Tracking speeds:
Shooter: 80 + 70 = 150
Enforcer: 120 + 130 = 250
Defender: 60 + 50 = 110
Speeder: 100 + 90 = 190
Fixer: 70 + 110 = 180

After hotfix:
Shooter 70 + 70 = 140 (-10)
Enforcer: 120 + 130 = 250
Defender: 50 + 50 = 100 (-10)
Speeder: 90 + 90 = 180 (-10)
Fixer: 70 + 110 = 180