Difficulties pushing infamy

Mine comes from when I see the same players do poorly and not play as a team in their matchup every game, still win and stay in the same infamy range when I see the same players do very good, lose still and drop.

The reason I say it's flawed is because a player can do poorly and win as much infamy as a player who carried them when on the other hand a player can do very bad and cost a team the loss and get the same reduction as a player that does the highest contribution out of all 10 players in the lobby.

There are no bonus infamy reduction to a player who floated or didn't play with their team so they died in the first few seconds of a game. No less infamy reductions for players who contributed more than all 10 players in the match and recieved a loss.

I understand contribution is hard to calculate automatically because of healing and incendiary/frost items and all the different boats, but if they were reworked, which I think was talked about being in next update, (so no one spams firebombs) there could at least be a small reduction in cases where a player does top contribution and loses they lose less rewards or if a floater wins after being inactive all game they win less (if they disconnected) or none (if they had connection while floating and just decided not to move). In most cases where if a floater loses, they could get a bigger infamy reduction. And some boats' contributions could be reworked like the fixer and the speeder.

I'm also not trying to speak for myself because I have my good and bad games and I feel when you're at THAT point, you are at a good and fair infamy range. But sometimes, you can be sure that you did enough and were such a great asset to the team to where you should have had your victory. But that I accept, because I realize I am only 20% of my team and I can't always have great teammates but the thing that gets me is recieving the same rewards as a player who did poorly.

Does someone deserve +24 infamy dealing top contribution out of all players in the game, yes. Does a teammate in that same game who dealt the lowest contribution out of all 10 players deserve a +24 infamy? That, I don't think. If they performed poorly it's because they weren't playing as a team or just are not fit to be in those matchups, both of which I find a punishable offense in infamy.

 

Didn't mean to make it personal. I apologize.

 

How close to 50-50% do you usually get? I feel most battles I'm in have some level of handicap. I've won wildly imbalanced fights for 27 infamy gain (our highest was 3200 inf, unfriends had Bloody Devil at 4400 inf).. and I've lost horribly outclassed matches for ~19 infamy loss. Can I assume 25 is a perfectly balanced match? Could you explain to us how handicap is calculated?

 

So you think that a match that ends
5-0 or 0-5 is 50-50 win rate cuz thats all im seeing everytime i go into a match i either win 5-0/ 5-1 or lose
5-0/5-1
Also i agree with joeyaa since everyone is playing shooter now and im not im expecting to have one of the lowest contributions cuz i dont use fire or freeze items
BUT GUESS WHAT ... NOPE
Shooters who stay alive for the whole match and i stay alive for the whole match (shooters have legendaries and high tier epics, i have rares) DEAL LESS DMG THAN A GUY WITH HALF THEIR WEAPONS? WHY? Why am i getting matched with them match me with someone who weny threw the tutorial and knows how to tap one button and spam mortars

 

I've kinda come around on this. It sucks sometimes. We get bad teammates, hell sometimes we play bad ourselves. Besides the seal clubbers, I started to understand what @Miika is saying, seeing it kinda clarifies it. If you're competitive you move up.

This players we all hate, if you look at the stats at the end of a battle those shooters with all mortars have done a lot of damage and "influenced" the match.
I go in, I fight my ass off, do 4k damage and the guy chucking long range mortars have done 6k.

 

i am i was at 2400 and dropped to 2000 and i cant manage to get back up, so rn i am just trying different set ups. i also think your totally right p2w players should not be able to play with people who dont use money, because it's like we are committing suicide!

 

I've been very critical of the infamy system used in matchmaking in the past. One thing that I always questioned was why the opponents more often than not had a total ship MK score higher than my team. One thing that I failed to realize was that I was an MK 3 ship in a fleet with another MK 3 ship; and we were playing in the 800-900 range among mostly MK 4s. The guy that I was fleeting with pointed out that we were the ones bringing down the total MK score for our team. Our two MK 3's were the reason more often than not, that our team had a lower total MK, since the opponents almost always had all 4's. Mix in the 5's playing in that range, and it makes it even worse. But looking at it from a different perspective, it is something of a compliment to be playing with a lower ranked ship among bigger guys.

The other thing that happens, I believe that there is certain degree of Cognitive Dissonance playing the game. In other words, some people tend to focus on when their team is seemingly matched at a disadvantage to their opponent, but fail to recognize when and how often the match up is in their favor. A good example of this, I was hit with a six game losing streak recently. During that streak, there was a game with a floater. One game, there was a speeder that tried to go around but ended up being caught head on by all of the enemy. Other two games, there was a MK5 on the other team and we had none. Then there was a game where we had a fleet on our team with an MK4 teamed up with an MK1 (why people do that is beyond me). The game keeps screwing me in matching right?

But then, I looked at the match ups during a stretch where I was 9-1, and realized that during those matches; there were five of them where I benefited from the same things that I think contributed to my losses: floaters being on the other team, that MK2 on the other team that did 200 pts of damage before he was snuffed out, that suicide speeder that charged into us and got squashed, a few matches where the MK5s were on our side and the opponent had none. As much as I've been stuck with bad teammates, I've also benefited from bad teammates on the opposition.

Try creating a game log, note incidents, and keep stats. Once I started doing that, I discovered that it pretty much evens out overall.

 

I agree with almost everything you guys say. Recently however I've noticed more and more pure P2W players that dominate the scoreboards. I get that the top of Nightmare is a very select group, but I feel like rewards for end of season in Nightmare and maybe even Ace I top 3 increased to 2 x Legendary item pieces. The way it currently stands, you have to play at Nightmare league level for 20 weeks (almost half the year) just to get 1 legendary weapon ( if you lucky out and only get red item pieces ). That means it will literally take YEARS until anyone will be able to start competing with players like Bunta and Banderas, at least in terms of gear wise, due to the fact they have almost T5 legendary for all their items.

Once again I totally understand the fact that F2P will eventually reach those end game weapons. But the way it currently stands, the difference in speed is just way too big. But again, at the end of the day I don't really care. My goal is to reach the bottom of Nightmare; I don't really care about being #1. Also your behind the scenes stats and whatnot probably prove me wrong, which is fair enough.

I also get that there will always be the odd player like Orpheus who can't be held back by lack of legendaries.

Also this comment is slightly off-topic, relating more to the level of progress from Epics to Legendaries. I do not have any issue with the current infamy system and completely understand how ones win-rate balances out once they reach a level they are meant to be at due to their skill and or item levels.

/endoverlylongmessagethatwasn'tplannedtobethislong

 

The infamy system is not perfect but it certainly is not as flawed as people claim it is. I hate the fact that there is an infamy reset for nightmare and it's slightly depressing how nobody tries to see how resetting the infamy at the top influences everybody playing the game (While it is true that the pressure relieves off a bit more near the bottom due to the bigger player base in the lower leagues, we all fail to see that while the people who downloaded the app maybe more than 5 million, the active users are significantly less, average of maybe 50k per day).

However, the matches I have played may seem unfair to me but isn't really that unfair, most of the matches I have lost cause I was matched against teams with more higher mk lvl ships than my team was cause either my team gave up before the match even started or cause the unfriends were super fired up cause they had better gear.

NOT BECAUSE OUR TEAM WAS WEAKER THAN THEIRS. So please stop complaining that you aren't where you are supposed to be cause of them (p2p players) or the system cause we're just making up excuses for losing and being lame losers.

 

We currently have players using underlevelled weapons they aren't good at using just cause it gives them extra stars, nobidy thinks twice about being selfish and using gears that would be unfavorable for their team just so they can farm 1 extra star (Fire Bomb and Napalm).

If players were rewarded infamy based on their contribution rather than winning or losing then players will stop trying to win at all and instead play even more selfishly than they already do. I'm sorry but I think what you say is a very very very bad idea.

 

What Mikka said about perception of fairness is interesting. In Hearthstone a card called mind control lets you steal an opponent minion. All blizzards statistical data showed the card was 'fair' in that its use did not overly affect win rates but they still nerfed it because it FELT so unfair to lose to. In mobile games sometimes statistics aren't enough if people feel the matchmaking is unfair they will get disheartened and quit losing the devs revenue long term.

 

What people are often missing is that you can't seperate paying and non paying players. People pay for stuff to be stronger than others and rise in infamy. Seperating them because they paid would remove their incentive to pay ---> noone pays ---> no money ---> game dies.

 

Yeah i just cant accept that when i press battle i need luck not win but to get matched with the winning team and thats just not fair

 

You dont. You just need to get better at the game, or get better gear, or both.

 

I'm totally with you on the general argument you raise in this thread. However, writing f2p and T5 epic in the same sentense is just silly. Before you changed shop system I suppose you could grind it out (akin to 30k Blacktail games), under the current system the timeframe required to reach t5 epic (of a desired item) is so dramatically increased that odds are that noone is there yet (nor wont be before 2019).
F2p and t5 epic has zero correlation, it is what it is but lets be honest and upfront about it!
---
On average you'd need to complete 210 epic items to get a specific epic to t5 - Luck can trim this heavily (or keep giving you Standard Mortars), but consider how many epics you acquire pr month and do your own math.

 

The problem is it doesn't average out, because infamy is not an average, it's a sum.

I'm fairly new here, so I'm currently only at about 500 infamy (I have been a bit higher). It's taken me ~600 games to get this far, but it would only take 20 to send me back to zero. That's not how averages work.

While it would be fairly unlucky to go all the way to zero, it demonstrates just how volatile infamy can swing. And it's actually quite easy for someone to lose hundreds of point with a run of bad luck. Even if they didn't play that badly.

I've been from nearly 700 down to 180 and back to 500 in one day. Today, I don't know where I will end up. I could finish on 900 or 150. Every time I hit the battle button it's a complete gamble.

TBH I don't really belong at 180. Not because I think I'm better than I am, but because my ship and my equipment are superior to most other people at that level. Unfortunatly, when I do get bounced down there, I'm still occasionally running into other mk3s (presumably also having a bad day), and it's inevitable that one of us has to go down even further.

This probably isn't fun for all the mk1 ships, wondering why there is a mk3 ship in their games. Just like it isn't much fun for me when a mk5 with epic weapons gets bounced down into the 500s, but one event causes the other. I think that's why the match making can seem so unfair at times.

I would say that very few of my games (win or lose) are genuine "team efforts". Much of the time there is at least one player who contributes nothing (300 damage and sinks), then there is one player who is a monster and kills 3 ship on his own. For the people in the middle it's really just dumb luck whether they get carried up or dragged down.

I honestly believe that if the infamy system were more accurate, and less volatile (like a real average), it would make for a much better team game. You'd be more likely to be matched with people of your own level, and the win would genuinely depend on teamwork, rather than a few underrated big hitters owning the game as they try to claw back to their propper level.

 

@Miika

Everybody loves war robots matchmaking, why not cinsider using that one?.

Why deliberately use something so many people hate?

 

Because ... something ... something ... sports use it somehow.

There is no good reason other than "this is what we came up with and have convinced ourselves that it's the right thing to do, and will tell you everyone else does it as well to convince you we're right."