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Let's end the nerf circle. Buff instead!

Discussion in 'Game Discussion' started by Help I Cant Swim, 1 Mar 2018.

  1. Help I Cant Swim

    Help I Cant Swim MVP

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    Posting a thread just to nerf a single playstyle or item is lazy and only leads to dissension. Unless there is something that is massively overpowered, I don't believe that nerfs are the correct answer.

    Instead, let us think of ways to buff counters to what people would like to nerf. Buffs are almost always seen in a positive light, but nerfs are almost always seen negatively.

    The most current nerf threads are for Double Bubble Enforcers. Let's come up with some creative ways to offer alternatives to and counter this meta playstyle. I believe that a small buff to Tesla Bolt cooldown and a small buff to frost-torp combo could help Speeders counter the Double Bubble and could give Enforcers a different option than just using 2 bubbles. I think a reduction to the Explosive Cannon cooldown could help Defenders and Speeders as well.

    What else would be a good counter to the Double Bubble? I'll start a poll once we get a handful of good suggestions.

    Edit:
    Here are all of the current suggestions for buffs:
    • Frost Blaster - Make it break on a certain damage threshold, not just any damage
    • Frost Blaster - No damage breaking, but max duration reduction
    • Tesla Bolt - Decrease cooldown (at cost of healing block?)
    • Explosive Cannon - Decrease cooldown (maybe a Bhurt option.. +Range and Damage or -Cooldown)
    • Triple Torpedo - ?? Definitely needs a buff, but what? Angle? Damage? Speed? 1 slot? (I don't use, can a user suggest something? @Stelmo)
    • Defender - Provide passive buff to defense points of nearby teammates. Can be increased in Brock training.

    I am just listing the suggestions first so we can discuss them and make them more detailed before I add them to a poll. There's no reason to have a poll before we have fully thought out the buffs.

    Please continue to make suggestions and discuss these options.
     
    Last edited: 2 Mar 2018
  2. Sifa

    Sifa Well-Known Member

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    Support for this thread, I'm so tired of seeing all those nerf posts every day here :)

    As you said, buffing frost-torp combo would be perfect counter for double tesla shield (since both frost and torps go straight through the shield). Anything better doesn't come to my mind now.
     
  3. Help I Cant Swim

    Help I Cant Swim MVP

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    Thanks! I think the frost combo would be a great counter to Enforcers AND to Shooters. Plus it would make Speeders competitive again. And it would give the Enforcers another option other than using Double Bubble.
     
    Neptune_Gaming likes this.
  4. Shadow Moon!

    Shadow Moon! Well-Known Member

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    There should be option to tesla bolt either heal block or low cooldowns.
    EC is broken idk what should be done to make it more viable again. Maybe increased range with high cooldown and short range with low cooldown options in talent trees.
     
  5. Stelmo

    Stelmo Well-Known Member

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    A proper tritorp buff would make a massive difference.
     
  6. Kalbs

    Kalbs Well-Known Member

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    Double level 1 Tesla bolt :p
     
    Help I Cant Swim likes this.
  7. Neptune_Gaming

    Neptune_Gaming Well-Known Member

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    i completely agree man.Tri torp is totally dead and im helpless now
     
  8. Neptune_Gaming

    Neptune_Gaming Well-Known Member

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    i feel increasing tesla shield cool down so that it has to be used specifically and strategically like teslabolt and not just be spammed over and over again:mad::mad::(:(
     
  9. d_p air

    d_p air Member

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    Are you playing speeder? Because the topic looks like that you don't want some buffs against double tesla shields, but indirect say that devs should just buff speeder. The suggested frost-torp buff, tesla bolt buff will be advantageous primarily for speeders that will help them against ALL ships, not just against double TS enforcers.

    In the other topic concerning this new dominating meta it was a very good suggestion: TS should work the same way as tesla bolt. There is a stun resistance for some time after the first stun, that reduces the time of the next one. So if you pop up the second shield immediatly after the end of the first, its duration and/or strength should be reduced in the same way as with tesla bolt. I think it would really useful and logical to implement the same method, as they are both Tesla items.

    And this will be really ONLY against double TS meta and will not nerf speeders with one TS.
     
    Last edited: 2 Mar 2018
  10. Stelmo

    Stelmo Well-Known Member

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    Tesla shield cooldown is already 20 seconds. Any cooldown increase would be a massive speeder nerf.
     
  11. Help I Cant Swim

    Help I Cant Swim MVP

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    I used to play speeder but switched to maining an Enforcer over a month ago. Maybe longer. Not sure. It just felt more fluid and natural. I like that idea too and will definitely add it into the poll once we get a few more options. But I also think that a frost torp buff is necessary. I've never used frost torp (only have lvl1 frost items), but I don't like seeing an entire playstyle just disappear overnight.

    And the reason I am mentioning buffs specific to Speeder and alternatives for Enforcer is because those are the only ships that I play. I don't know what the other ships need because I'm not familiar with them. That's why I asked for more suggestions. :)
     
    Neptune_Gaming likes this.
  12. Help I Cant Swim

    Help I Cant Swim MVP

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    I play Enforcer and Speeder. Enforcer is currently better than Speeder. That is not an opinion, that is a fact.
     
  13. Ash KOT

    Ash KOT MVP

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    Great thread @Help I Cant Swim .
    The meta is defined by being the strongest setup, and unless an item is majorly overpowered, then its better to buff other, less used items and set ups to make them viable.
    If every update we insist on nerfing the meta, over time we will all be using the same crap, heavily nerfed set up, with no variety.
    This is already starting to shine through with the amount of double bubble enforcers in game right now.

    Instead the situation should be flipped on its head.
    Devs should be looking at the least used items (tri torps, frost, rudder etc) and buffing them to a point where they offer a viable alternative to the meta.
    If frost was still decent I guarantee we would see a better split of enforcers with some using frost launcher / torp combos etc.

    It just seems that the mentality now is nerf everything and all we are doing is taking backward steps.
    Whats worse is the nerfs / buffs are very extreme in BB compared to other games, usually items are tweaked by 3%-5% at a time, here we see items tweaked by as much as 50% which just isn't feasible and kills set ups in a heartbeat, which is cruel when someone has spent months and probably invested money in said set up.
     
  14. Shadow Moon!

    Shadow Moon! Well-Known Member

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    And the RNG is cruel when your one setup is dusted to ground it takes months to get new.
    Same things were done to frost triple nerf and it was useless.
    Triple nerf to bolt and it became useless.
    Triple nerf to EC and it became useless.
     
    Help I Cant Swim likes this.
  15. Crashedup

    Crashedup Well-Known Member

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    I am actually interested in what kind of ideas you guys will come up with.
    Surprise me:)
     
    Help I Cant Swim likes this.
  16. Help I Cant Swim

    Help I Cant Swim MVP

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    I agree that it is only the Double Bubbles that are trouble, not the Single Bubbles. I think everybody understands that. But what is your suggestion to counter that with a buff? That is what we are doing in this thread. We are trying to get alternative/counter items buffed to produce a more diverse meta, rather than nerfing items and creating a stale meta.
     
    Wrecked likes this.
  17. Babablacksheep

    Babablacksheep Well-Known Member

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    Nothing needs more work currently than---Frost blaster.

    This is a great thread, so please Respectfully GTFO if you want to Talk about Enforcer or shooter nerfs

    I would say Give Mk5 Speeder 3BBB.1 std shield+1 bandage (element for recovery) or 2 std shields (more HP). They can always Use big shield if they want..

    And also i think mk6 defender is fine, but i created a thread for Mk5 and Mk4 defenders to increase the popularity since they are bit underpowered at low levels.What are you thoughts on that!

    https://forum.battlebay.net/threads/the-improvements-of-mk4-and-mk5-defenders.15016/
     
  18. noobkiller

    noobkiller New Member

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    So instead of useless nerfs why not bring back old explosive cannon (it can solve some defender issues too)...and reduce tesla bolt Cooldown by 4 sec(or whatever that stays under OP line)..
     
    Help I Cant Swim likes this.
  19. Help I Cant Swim

    Help I Cant Swim MVP

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    It is in the options :)
     
  20. a_creeper_won

    a_creeper_won Well-Known Member

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    All in favour of starting a Battle Bay Society To End Nerfs (BBSTEN) Say aye !
     

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